View Full Version : Eibach Sway Bars?....
shadye90
02-05-2006, 07:28 PM
I am seriously considering to get the Eibach Sway bar set..I already have the sport package which is great but want more..What do you guys think?..
diesel007
02-05-2006, 08:24 PM
I think springs will make the biggest difference if less body roll is what your after. The sway bars are going to do very little, the car is already extremely stable.
Diesel is wrong here,
On my E30 (the only car I modded stuff with) I first put lowering springs on, which reduced body roll a bit, then later I added swaybars which reduced body roll A LOT.
Lowering springs make your ride rougher, while sways won't.
Also swaybars can be adjusted to make your handling more neutral (you can dial out some of the factory set understeer, set the rear bar to full firm)
People generally do lowering springs for asthetic reasons, swaybars are a better bang for the buck mod
ksfrogman
02-05-2006, 10:58 PM
I assume you're thinking about changing both front and rear sway bars. Swapping out the front one alone for a stiffer anti-roll bar will increase understeer. Similarly, increasing the stiffness of the rear anti-roll bar alone will increase oversteer.
In theory, decreasing body roll in the twisties should help cornering, but I've read articles where stiffness decreased slalom and/or lap times. On non-smooth services or bumpy curves, I wonder if the added stiffness would actually impair the suspension's ability to absorb the shock of the bumps while maintaining the car's composure.
diesel007
02-05-2006, 11:04 PM
Diesel is wrong here,
On my E30 (the only car I modded stuff with) I first put lowering springs on, which reduced body roll a bit, then later I added swaybars which reduced body roll A LOT.
Lowering springs make your ride rougher, while sways won't.
Also swaybars can be adjusted to make your handling more neutral (you can dial out some of the factory set understeer, set the rear bar to full firm)
People generally do lowering springs for asthetic reasons, swaybars are a better bang for the buck mod
You are comparing an e30 to an e90 they are two completely different cars. :confused2 . If you read my post I said that the e90 already comes very solid from the factory, therefore changing the sway bars is really not going to a whole lot.
What experience do you have with tuning suspension on an e90 to say I am wrong?
You are comparing an e30 to an e90 they are two completely different cars. :confused2 . If you read my post I said that the e90 already comes very solid from the factory, therefore changing the sway bars is really not going to a whole lot.
What experience do you have with tuning suspension on an e90 to say I am wrong?
the E90 is decent, but even with sport pack it has a lot of body roll
I see that you think the E90 is very solid, more solid than a stock E30 but much less solid than many other cars on the road. Go drive a Z4 or Boxster and then tell me you still think the E90 is "solid"
you also (maybe I misunderstood) stated that changing springs would reduce body roll more than changing swaybars. That's just a clear misunderstanding of what suspension components do what....
the swaybars (also known as anti roll bars) are there to reduce body roll, lowering the car with stiffer springs will reduce body roll but not as much as improving the part of the car that's designed to reduce body roll :bonk:
suspension tuning is pretty similar for all cars, knowledge from an E30 is VERY valid when talking about an E90.
The frogman is also correct that very stiff sways can unsettle the car in large mid corner bumps, the car will be better on smooth pavement but will give up a little bit if the road gets really bumpy in the corners. There is ZERO drawback to swaybars when you're traveling in a straight line (unlike lowering springs)
if you want to corner better, the sways will GREATLY aid in transitions from left to right (slalom type maneuvers)
diesel007
02-05-2006, 11:38 PM
You never answered my question. I agree with you that sway bars will decrease body roll, but in my PERSONAL experience with changing out the springs on my e90 it has made a very significant decrease in body roll. You are saying my personal experience is wrong that is why I asked you if you have any suspension mods on the e90.
Yes the ride is stiffer but it's not race car stiff. If I added the sways it would be even better so lets agree on that. Again we are talking about an e90 here no a boxer or z4 or e30.
You never answered my question. I agree with you that sway bars will decrease body roll, but in my PERSONAL experience with changing out the springs on my e90 it has made a very significant decrease in body roll. You are saying my personal experience is wrong that is why I asked you if you have any suspension mods on the e90.
Yes the ride is stiffer but it's not race car stiff. If I added the sways it would be even better so lets agree on that. Again we are talking about an e90 here no a boxer or z4 or e30.
you have lowered your car,
I have lowered a similar car AND upgraded swaybars. you have zero experience with upgrading swaybars and have no basis of comparison as to what a set of sways will do compared to a set of springs.
if you next add a set of swaybars to your car then I'm sure you'll agree with me that they make a larger difference in body roll reduction than the springs (I never said springs don't/won't help body roll, I said they help LESS than sways. If I was modding my car I would personally do the sways first if I only had the budget to do it a bit at a time)
I really don't understand how my experience with lowering springs AND swaybars is somehow less valid than your experience with lowering springs only
I hope Shady finds our comments usefull
shadye90
02-06-2006, 12:05 AM
you have lowered your car,
I have lowered a similar car AND upgraded swaybars. you have zero experience with upgrading swaybars and have no basis of comparison as to what a set of sways will do compared to a set of springs.
if you next add a set of swaybars to your car then I'm sure you'll agree with me that they make a larger difference in body roll reduction than the springs (I never said springs don't/won't help body roll, I said they help LESS than sways. If I was modding my car I would personally do the sways first if I only had the budget to do it a bit at a time)
I really don't understand how my experience with lowering springs AND swaybars is somehow less valid than your experience with lowering springs only
I hope Shady finds our comments usefull
Thanks guys for all your comments and opinions..The way I looked at it was this..The sport package already lowered the car 10mm...I've examined the front and rear sway bars and they seem kinda small..especially the rear..In the past I've done a lot of suspension tuning on Japanese cars and have always found sway bars to make a big difference in handling..I'll most likely order the Eibachs this week and as soon as I get em I'll do a write up/DIY..Again thanks for all your help...
is eibach the only company making sways right now for our cars?
longtran
02-06-2006, 02:04 AM
is eibach the only company making sways right now for our cars?
uuc motorwerks coming out with some by next month i think.
diesel007
02-06-2006, 12:43 PM
I hope Shady finds our comments usefull
Your information is very valid and true, I was just throwing my 2 cents from my experience. I will most likely be upgrading my swaybars in the future. :thumbsup:
uuc motorwerks coming out with some by next month i think.
Is this true? I've been trying to get info from UUC for a while now. My e46's had swaybarbarians, and I loved them.
By the way, that rear sway (even on the sports package) is a joke, if you look at it. It's more the size of a linguine.. I can't believe it is doing much of anything, given it's puny size, and the forces it is supposed to counteract.
Another thing you'll notice is that the rear sway appears go over the rear end, and bolt to the top of the diff. that may prove tricky to replace. I haven't actually gotten under there, but it didn't look too fun, when I saw it while swapping out my track wheels/tires.
longtran
02-10-2006, 01:59 PM
Is this true? I've been trying to get info from UUC for a while now. My e46's had swaybarbarians, and I loved them.
By the way, that rear sway (even on the sports package) is a joke, if you look at it. It's more the size of a linguine.. I can't believe it is doing much of anything, given it's puny size, and the forces it is supposed to counteract.
Another thing you'll notice is that the rear sway appears go over the rear end, and bolt to the top of the diff. that may prove tricky to replace. I haven't actually gotten under there, but it didn't look too fun, when I saw it while swapping out my track wheels/tires.
yes this is true. how i know its true? they used my car to make them. i will be geting them put on soon i hope.
I thought for our e90(or any rear drive car) that to get more oversteer, leave the back bar alone and upgrade the front bar. The opposite proved right for my FWD car, I upgrade the rear bar and the car turned on a dime! Guess I'm wrong.
Danny
it's the same for FWD and RWD, to get more oversteer add more (stiffer) rear swaybar
you're right Danny, the rear bar is the key!
yes this is true. how i know its true? they used my car to make them. i will be geting them put on soon i hope.
Fantastic! Thanks for the info. Did you go out to their shop in Hillsborough, NJ?
db17k
02-12-2006, 05:46 PM
I've heard that larger sway bars are pretty much useless/unnecessary unless your car is lowered with springs or coil overs.
I've heard that larger sway bars are pretty much useless/unnecessary unless your car is lowered with springs or coil overs.
they are completely useless, unless you want to reduce body roll
db17k
02-12-2006, 08:14 PM
they are completely useless, unless you want to reduce body roll
you know what i meant, aftermarket.
you know what i meant, aftermarket.
I know exactly what you meant
swaybars will do more to help handling than springs will
db17k
02-12-2006, 08:53 PM
I know exactly what you meant
swaybars will do more to help handling than springs will
I have no experience with sway bars, but that's what i was told from the SA at modacar when inquiring about just getting sway bars and not springs when i had my RSX. well good to know, thanks :)
I know exactly what you meant
swaybars will do more to help handling than springs will
This is totally true.
A spring's major function is to keep the tire planted that it's installed on by reducing rebound time of a shock... just by the fact it's a heavier spring. It does help body roll somewhat. It's largely used alone by tuners to lower the car and stiffen it somewhat.
A swaybar traverses the left to right sides of the car in both the front and rear, and it's major function is to minimize body lean. This also helps to keep the inside of the car (in a turn) more planted. You get the added bonus of being able to adjust the stiffness, which helps control under/oversteer.
Upgrading sways alone are a far better suspension modification than springs alone, if your aim is to improve the handling characteristics of your ride. Ask any driving instructor and they'll agree. If you were talking about a fully adjustable coilover conversion, that's a totally different story.
Ed_330i
02-13-2006, 10:19 PM
does anyone have a link for these sway bars? how much?
bavauto.com has the eibach set for $454.95. I haven't seen any other manufacturer's sways for sale yet.
Supposedly UUC has a set coming out next month, as well as H&R. No specs on UUC's yet though.
hsiaochinsan
02-13-2006, 11:39 PM
GMP performance has both Eibach and H&R set for sale. The Eibach set price is pretty good here: $398.30. H&R is more expensive: $269.10 for the front and $170.10 for the rear.
Here is the link:
http://www.gmpperformance.com/index.cfm?PG=byVehicle_list_parts&CID=5438
lux.sh
02-14-2006, 01:58 AM
If someone was to tell me to pick one for handling characteristics, it'll be sway bar over springs.
Slapping on some springs are just for looks for majority of the people. If you really want improved handling out of it, go along with correct coilover setup specifically designed for your vehicle, and matched spring rate. Lowered center of gravity does help in terms of reducing body roll, but that only feels so good until you've felt the difference from upgraded sway bar.
AW330i
02-16-2006, 12:54 AM
are the H&R sways adjustable?
I think they are adjustable...
Danny
I think they are adjustable...
Danny
According to the linked site Gmp Performance (http://www.gmpperformance.com/index.cfm?PG=byVehicle_list_parts&CID=5438), the H&R sways are not adjustable. However, the picture appears that the fronts are not, but the rears seem like they have 3 holes on each side.
I bet it's a stock photo though. I'd believe the text before the picture.
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