[dubversion]

Hi all,

With some pain in my heart i will try to show you how we successfully build in the HFS4 v2 in the engine bay. It's with great sadness that after the test day, i returned home and an hour later my car was stolen.

I'll write the build here, so at least that was not a total loss.

First of all, a warning. I never planned to use more than 50% meth. I highly doubt that this setup is good for 100% meth. It's very flammable and i'm not comfortable with my BOV opening up to excrete methanol vapor. Bad things are going to happen.

I build in the kit in two days. The first day we concentrated on the hardware part, the second day we tweaked some of the hardware and did all the testing so it's ready to be tuned. I own a E91 Touring, and i did not want a tank in my trunk, meaning the pump will go in the engine bay and the water meth tank will be my windshield whiper tank (WW tank). This is NOT AT ALL how Richard designed this setup.

Moreover, when it came to find a place to fit the HFS4 controller, i decided to put it in the ECU box. Again, NOT AT ALL how Richard suggests to do it, as it may be more prone to malfunction due to condensed water.

So my setup is far from ideal, but all in all still workable. The write up may hint to some pitfalls and interesting solutions if you are also looking for an engine bay mount using the WW tank. Obviously neither Richard nor I are in any way, shape of form responsible for any damage done by trying to copy the work i did. This is merely a write up to show you how i did it. I strongly suggest that if you can, stick to Richard's instructions in the manual, which differs here and there from my setup.

Having said that, let's begin.

What kind of tools did we use, what was involved ?
First of all, it is imperative that you read the manual and study the wiring diagram. It doesn't take very long and will make you more efficient. I also suggest you don't do this installation alone if you're not very experienced. I had two friends help with the hardware, both with an automotive engineering background. I myself am just a hobbyist.

We used regular shop tools and did not need access to the bottom of the car, so you could do this in any dry place. you'll need to cut/solder some wires in your ECU box and tap signals. In our case i think it's 5. Please refer to Richard's diagram below for the 335i.

You'll need to take the right wheel off so you'll need tools for that and a jack.
You'll need small and medium sized tie wraps !

We used the 8 and 10mm wrench, soldering equipment, heat shrinks to seal the wire, insulation tape, duct tape (never leave home with out), 22 / 23 mm drill (for the holes in the WW tank), drill for tap hole 11/32" (8.8 mm) of the nozzles in the chargepipe, some self tapping metal screws, and a 2 mm drill to secure the pump to a custom made bracket which fits an existing arch shape in the engine bay (see pics).


My specific setup

As the pic shows, i have the dual cone intakes, which give a bit more breathing space under the hood for the nozzles and the lines. I also have the CP-E chargepipe. I decided to place the nozzles DOWNSTREAM of the MAF sensor, as some experts claim the injection may create incorrect readings of the MAF sensor and you don't want that during WOT. It's a choice i guess and each setup has pros and cons.

ECU Assembly



The white ECU plastic cover can be a little tricky to get off. there are two clips on the two opposite sides and two slides on the other sides. You don't need any tools to open it, patience will do.
I did not do this myself. You need to take your time to find the right wires and is clear from the diagram above. When it comes time to test (so the jumper in the controller is on SYS), make sure do DO connect also the green USER wire, as it has the (only) signal linking to pedal position (which is actually the fuel injector signal).

Because i told Richard to preset/solder the controller for the BMW N54, it saved my the hassle of setting that up. (the second part of the diagram above). So the only wire cutting or soldering is on 5 wires or so.

I think i used fuse 9 (which was not connected) to get the power for the gauge and the controller.


The ground signal from the controller was also taken from a ground signal out of the ECU.

Gauge


To get that casing out, you first need to clear the insulation and rubber around the shifter. No tools required, just wiggle/slide/turn until it comes off. It's stretchable, so it's an easy job. Next is to get the middle console cover out. You can take two credit cards and slide them at the driver's side AT THE BACK of the console. On the pic above you can see that side lifted already a bit. By putting a screwdriver between the credit cards you can pry it open without damaging the top, which is quite delicate. once you have your fingers underneath you can then find the other clips one by one and get the whole cover off. Once that's done you have simple access to the glasses compartment which i've build in the gauge.




I chose to put the gauge in the small compartment just above the shifter. I (rather cruedly) cut out some of the plastic and also removed some of the rubber of the pad so the gauge would be kept in place by friction. It took some reiteration, but i was happy with the end result. I have no pic of that. We fed the gauge cable from the controller thru a hole in the air vent. It took some time to wiggle it in there and get it into the fuse box, but it's a great place for it.



the cable from the controller to the gauge needs also a little trial and error. But moving thru the vents as shown made us straightforward, protected from water and more importantly removed the necessity to find and cut thru existing fire walls.





Fast Acting Valve - FAV

The FAV was not correctly assembled out of the box. We had to redo it, otherwise the line wouldn't fit on it. Here's a pic of it sitting on the chargepipe using a tie wrap.



Pump
There's only one place we could find to fit the pump.

There's a strong arch holding the power steering oil and we cut a bit of it underneath to make room for the pump. It's secured by two screws on the chasis. Regretfully, one was fully eroded and broke when trying to loosen it. After shrugging shoulders and after talking to Richard we revisited the pump install and decided to cut an extra piece of aluminium so at least all 4 screws of the pump (with rubber padding) were secured to the metal arch.


The location of the arch near the wheel seemed secure enough not to get too wet, something Richard expressed his concerns about.
Notice that the pump is upside down (the power cable is at the bottom) and I therefore also wrapped some insulation tape around it, to keep moist from entering the pump.

The pump takes significant power. Because it uses a relais, we took the power straight from the dynamo. Power is only fed to the pump when the controller also has power. Using fuse 9 you make sure that when the car is off, no power goes to the pump (or controller).




WW tank

It's a nightmare to take this out. the WW tank is located on the right side of the car towards the door, behind the wheel arch. The tank itself is actually arched to fit there. You'll need to take out the side blinker. You push it towards the engine or the opposite way, just try both, and when you think you're about to break it, you'll feel some movement. By sliding it a bit more, you can then pull it towards you. It's held in place by friction. And doing a good job of that... When reinstalling the WW tank, make sure you use a little bit of tape to the cable for the blinker, so you can easily reconnect it back to the light.

You'll need to take the wheel off and there's A LOT of screws to unbolt. They're all easy, just remember how it all fits back, you don't want to have spare parts when you're done...
Once the side blinker and all the bolts and wheel arch casing parts are out of the way, the WW tank itself is visible. Now you'll have to get it out. It's not easy, but basically it comes towards the front of the engine. I had to use some force acquired from a lack of patience after fiddling with it for 20 minutes. Getting it back was easier. The unit has a pumps on it, i reckon one for the WW and one for the Xenon lights. I drilled the third spot with the 22/23 mm drill for the HFS4 meth intake. it fits neatly and the filter also fits:



Don't forget to clean the tank with water when you have it out. Also test your setup for leaks before you reinstall it.


Chargepipe
As mentioned, we drilled DOWNSTREAM from the MAP sensor. I decided to go with the 2 x 1.0 mm nozzles:


Don't forget the loctite. the cp-e chargepipe was pretty thin. Maybe three smaller nozzles would also be a good idea and put them in a circle around the chargepipe, so the spray is as uniform around the pipe as possible. You don't want one cylinder to get more water than the other. Richard's point is that for this fact you should give the water more time to evaporate by getting it more UPSTREAM towards the intercooler. I was just very afraid of a false MAP sensor reading.

One of the tap in the chargepipe was at best one rotation. It would be an improvement to weld in a thicker piece in which you could drill more tap. However, we managed to get it to work without leakage and it felt tight and strong enough.


Securing wires
Remember that dual cones move around A LOT on high speed. keep wires securely in place using tie wraps and away from hot or moving parts. You do not want a rupture with high flammable meth while you're drving or racing...


Testing the unit
As i said, because our cars have direct injection, the green USER cable also needs to be connected when testing:

The purging of the pump is pretty easy with a bucket. We did a a couple of times.
Now is also a good time to turn the dial on the gauge called "SC" which tweaks the amount of bars against the fuel injector sensor signal. I think we had it set at about 11 o'clock. You can do it when you're testing the spray pattern, as Richard explains in his manual in test 3.


The HFS4 comes with dummies to plug into the nozzle holes of the charge pipe.

Then you get ready to spray against the windshield, we used ducttape:


We did not yet set up the failsafes, because we still needed to tune. there's a jumper to bypass the failsafes, we had it set ON (so bypass the failsafe settings on the gauge).

the Thres dial inside the controller was the last thing we set. For our application, it turned out you need to turn it almost completely counter clock wise (so setting it very low/sensitive). I would say we had to set it to 3 o'clock and minimum is 4 o'clock. If Thres is not set correctly, you'll be doing your test drive, do a WOT, but no or little spray is seen.


Final notes:

- The gauge actually has an ON/OFF button. Very handy but hard to notice when you look at the gauge.
- The pump vibrates a lot, so make sure you use all 4 screws to secure it.
- Direct injection needs the green USER connector to the controller in the SYS jumper during initial testing.
- Make sure that you stick to the test procedure as descibred. Don't skip the tests.


Final result:



And then the car was stolen....

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Excellent write up but as a caution to members the windshield washer location is a HUGE fire hazard. Many 335i have caught on fire using that location. The methanol vapor coming out of the BOV is not even close to the issue with the fire hazards as those compared to the methanol in the WW tank, even at 50/50 mix.

For people reading this do yourself a favor and get a tank in the trunk.

It's also recommended to mount nozzles as far away from the TB as possible to improve atomization and so the TMAP can read the reduced IAT for tuning purposes.

[dubversion]

Thanks Jeff, i didn't make my point clear.

Some people warn very clearly about using the WW as the meth container...

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=687279


If you do this setup, perhaps it's best to only use water and add a bit of meth to stop rust from forming in the insides. 50/50 mix may already be too high.

Water is what i wanted to use for anti knocking; the meth is just a nice little extra, but obviously WW is not meant for meth, so make sure you do not run a high meth percentage with this setup.

[135Pats]

Nice DIY, though I share others thoughts about WW mounting it.

So sorry to hear it got stolen :/

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by dubversion

Thanks Jeff, i didn't make my point clear.

Some people warn very clearly about using the WW as the meth container...

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=687279


If you do this setup, perhaps it's best to only use water and add a bit of meth to stop rust from forming in the insides. 50/50 mix may already be too high.

Water is what i wanted to use for anti knocking; the meth is just a nice little extra, but obviously WW is not meant for meth, so make sure you do not run a high meth percentage with this setup.

Yea and that's only one instance. I know of about 12 guys personally off the top of my head. I'm sure there are many others they just dont post it publically for insurance purposes and such.

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

It's also recommended to mount nozzles as far away from the TB as possible to improve atomization and so the TMAP can read the reduced IAT for tuning purposes.

^ This!

Without your TMAP sensor reading a cooler intake charge the DME will start to pull timing in reaction to rising intake temperatures.

You maybe robbing yourself of power due to temperature mapping in the DME tables in spite of reducing knock in the combustion chamber by spraying downstream of the TMAP.

My intake temps never get more than 10* above ambient when spraying meth.....but the TMAP has to know this to prevent table intervention.

[dubversion]

Hi Ilma, i thought the 335i has a MAP so it reads air pressure. I want to cool the combustion and the manifold. This should be the same as in the chargepipe ?

But if the MAP sensor is soaked in water, i doubt it can read pressure correctly...

But i'm not a mechanic :/


This is one of the sources i based my decision on:

http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.c...icle_info.html

4. Pre Throttle Body/Carburetor Injection

water methanol injectionPositioning the water methanol injection nozzles or nozzles just before the throttle body or carburetor on turbocharged and centrifugal supercharger applications is by far the most common position and one of the most beneficial of all. Furthermore, most every application can easily be fitted in this manor. With injection taking place just before the throttle body/carburetor, inches before the intake of the engine, significant cylinder cooling and detonation suppression is achieved. Additionally, air charge temperatures are significantly reduced through the intake manifold.

Care should always be taken concerning adequate distribution. In many cases intake manifolds can have individual intake ports beginning right after the throttle body. In applications such as this, the nozzle need only be pulled back away from the throttle body 4-5 inches to ensure proper distribution between all intake ports and not feeding one more then others.

Many of our concerns are eliminated when injecting in this location such as injecting prior to the mass air meter, intercooler or being excessively to far away from the intake of the engine. With injection taking place right before the intake of the engine, the effects are maximized.

As already mentioned, positioning the water methanol injection nozzles or nozzles just before the throttle body or carburetor on turbocharged and centrifugal supercharger applications is by far the most common position and one of the most beneficial of all as it offer excellent air charge cooling and exceptionable detonation control and cylinder cooling.

So it's not *that* strange ?

[Ilma]

The N54 engine actually has two sensors.......a TMAP and a MAP.

One is on the intake manifold while the other is on the chargepipe before the throttle body.

The TMAP sensor is the one that measures intake temperatures (hence the prefixT = Tempature and Manifold Absolute Pressure) and I am pretty sure that is the one on the chargepipe before the throttle body.

The MAP sensor only measures intake manifold pressure and not temperature.

You are quoting material that is not specific to this engine and although it makes sense in other applications....... the N54 has some twists and turns (such as sensor placement).

In any case.....just measure your intake temperatures and see if they are dropping or not. I don't disagree that you are cooling the combustion chamber. I am just saying that your TMAP sensor will not read the cooler charge temps if it is behind your nozzles.

Our DME is know to pull timing out as intake temps rise.

That said.....there was another post on here where someone did multi nozzle direct port injection and got outstanding results with timing because of better methanol distribution......so it does work when applied correctly.....but I think that was using 6 nozzles tapped directly into the intake manifold.

You look to be using a dual nozzle approach although your nozzle location is moved further forward.....

Would be very interesting to see your results

Post up a log when you get a chance and please include AFR's and fuel trims for both banks as well as timing.

[335is808]

any luck recovering the car? :/ what cars gonna be next?

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by dubversion

Hi Ilma, i thought the 335i has a MAP so it reads air pressure. I want to cool the combustion and the manifold. This should be the same as in the chargepipe ?

But if the MAP sensor is soaked in water, i doubt it can read pressure correctly...

But i'm not a mechanic :/


This is one of the sources i based my decision on:

http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.c...icle_info.html



So it's not *that* strange ?

TMAP is pre throttle body for temperature and as mentioned if the intake air temp is not read correctly the tune will "De-tune" for the elevated intake air temps.

The MAP is in the intake manifold.

Originally Posted by Ilma

The N54 engine actually has two sensors.......a TMAP and a MAP.

One is on the intake manifold while the other is on the chargepipe before the throttle body.

The TMAP sensor is the one that measures intake temperatures (hence the prefixT = Tempature and Manifold Absolute Pressure) and I am pretty sure that is the one on the chargepipe before the throttle body.

The MAP sensor only measures intake manifold pressure and not temperature.

You are quoting material that is not specific to this engine and although it makes sense in other applications....... the N54 has some twists and turns (such as sensor placement).

In any case.....just measure your intake temperatures and see if they are dropping or not. I don't disagree that you are cooling the combustion chamber. I am just saying that your TMAP sensor will not read the cooler charge temps if it is behind your nozzles.

Our DME is know to pull timing out as intake temps rise.

That said.....there was another post on here where someone did multi nozzle direct port injection and got outstanding results with timing because of better methanol distribution......so it does work when applied correctly.....but I think that was using 6 nozzles tapped directly into the intake manifold.

You look to be using a dual nozzle approach although your nozzle location is moved further forward.....

Would be very interesting to see your results

Post up a log when you get a chance and please include AFR's and fuel trims for both banks as well as timing.

Correct

[dubversion]

Ilma, i have read temps compared to ambient temps after installing the intercooler. We wanted to see whether the dual cones (as opposed to "real" cold air intakes) would suffer from heat soak. This was barely noticeable and i'm not very concerned that with the setup i describe above the temperature difference is a problem. The chargepipe has no time to heat up the air, it would happen inside the compression chamber due to the nearby turbo, i mean this is why we install large intercoolers ?


Anyways, My point is that because i cool the places that usually get quite hot (i've felt the chargepipe when the engine is running and it's never hot, perhaps also because it's aluminium, with poor heat soaking capabilities). The intake manifold gets hot. If you cool it, it would drop the pressure in it. This means that more air can make it into the manifold (because there is less backpressure). Thus i would definately GAIN, also noticable at the TMAP and certainly of the MAP inside the manifold. I think the pressure difference is much more important than the few degrees in temperature. and don't forget the possibility of a false read due to condense water forming on the sensor.


Anyways, i can't proof my theory as my car got stolen. I just wanted to show in this thread how it's possible to have water injection in the engine bay and i think the most important point is that this is not a good setup for a high percentage meth injection, some further modification, specifically to the WW tank pipe and cover are needed. I never had a chance to get to that.

If i ever get the car back, i would love to try out an alternative charge pipe nozzle layout and see the difference. I have not seen evidence that would suggest one setup for our application is superior to the other. Maybe one day...

[dubversion]

Originally Posted by 335is808

any luck recovering the car? :/ what cars gonna be next?

Well, i'm now checking out the old E39 540i Touring. As insurance may not pay me at all, and considering my personal circumstances, this theft means end of my biggest hobby. I simply don't have the budget anymore and need to move on.

I organize a yearly meeting/event in the Netherlands for customized turbo (and supercharged) cars, but this nightmare may also kill that. I host one more on 3 AUG 2014 at the tracks in Zandvoort.

For more info, go to www.customturboworld.com

Kind regards,

Jeroen

[335is808]

Originally Posted by dubversion

Well, i'm not checking out the old E39 540i Touring. As insurance may not pay me at all, and considering my personal circumstances, this theft means end of my biggest hobby. I simply don't have the budget anymore and need to move on.

I organize a yearly meeting/event in the Netherlands for customized turbo (and supercharged) cars, but this nightmare may also kill that. I host one more on 3 AUG 2014 at the tracks in Zandvoort.

For more info, go to www.customturboworld.com

Kind regards,

Jeroen

I am sorry for your loss, I can only begin to imagine your pain... I would go into depression if my car was ever stolen.. Hope karma gets those no life sons of bitches back.. I hate thieves... Sorry for the vulgar language and i sincerely hope things get better for you.

[dubversion]

Originally Posted by 335is808

I am sorry for your loss, I can only begin to imagine your pain... I would go into depression if my car was ever stolen.. Hope karma gets those no life sons of bitches back.. I hate thieves... Sorry for the vulgar language and i sincerely hope things get better for you.

Thank you, it is appreciated. my car was fully modded, Wavetrac LSD, RB turbo's, Spec Stage 3+ clutch and metal flywheel, etc, etc. It feels like a lost a very good friend.